TD'11 Race Discussion

[AZtrailertrash]

I try to take in 6000 calories/day during efforts like these - it's about the maximum that my body can process, but it doesn't quite match what I actually burn, and I can't take in that much in really hot conditions. I'd estimate that is somewhere around 8000 calories/day, but that's assuming only a few hours of sleep per night. For 2-2.5 days in the Gila, the weight and volume of the food that has to be carried is impressively high. Hopefully all the riders have the capacity for both this and 5-7 liters of water!

Kevin, I am big, heavy, old, and slow.... 6'5, 225, 53 yrs old, but some parts of the Divide are on my Bucket list.  Don't think for a minute you are not a grand roll model and an inspiration for all of us.

[DaNM]

So krefs you prob wanted oranges and regular old water nearing the end. What was your drink of choice thru the furnace, or should I say wood stove, to get you to the panhandle?
  

[Pollyhound]

Well...That's that from Brush Mountain! 

A BIG thanks to you Kirsten for all you do for TD riders.  It is very much appreciated, not only by them but by the loved ones, friends and watchers.  Much love from across the pond

[DoctorRad]

However, the Gila as part of the Tour Divide was brutal for me ... I got caught up in a major storm and slushed through peanut butter for the better part of 45 miles.

As someone who is contemplating riding the Tour Divide before I'm 45, I gotta say that the mud is one of those things which scares me the most. I know of at least two sections where heavy rain can mean tens of miles of bike-clogging mud.

How do you veterans cope with it, both from the bike's point of view and your own (psychologically)?

[bcaverly]

First a big THANKS! to the gang at trackleaders.com for such a great service in the first place.

That said, is something wrong with the NoBo tracking?  They all seem to be listed as off course in 1000th place, and it is not reporting their mileage on the course.

Thanks again,

Bob

[Thumby]

Is there some "official" way that riders are notified of potential reroutes because of the fires in NM?  I'm sitting here at home knowing that my hubby (JE) is heading toward that section and he's in an area with no cell coverage to get info.

Does anyone know for sure if the route will be closed?  I'm trying to read everything I can find but it's all making my head swim.

I expect he'll stop in Vallecitos in the next few hours and maybe he'll call home.  I'd like to know what to tell him, if there is any news.

Trying really hard not to be worried, but it's tough.

Anyone have thoughts?

Elizabeth

[Mathewsen]

First a big THANKS! to the gang at trackleaders.com for such a great service in the first place.

That said, is something wrong with the NoBo tracking?  They all seem to be listed as off course in 1000th place, and it is not reporting their mileage on the course.

Thanks again,

Bob

Live tracking-generated leaderboards are complex stuff, particularly when you start having two concurrent fields of racers traveling in opposite directions. Scott M may chime in with a better answer than I can provide, but suffice it to say leaderboard data are generated based on geo-fencing and a 'smart route' file that contains a unique numerical value for each mile of the route.

For example, the course mile located 5 miles out from AW can be assigned 'mile 2,740', but i'm pretty sure it cannot simultaneously be 'mile 5' (for the purposes of a leaderboard). If anyone can figure out how to assign two simultaneous values to each unique mile on course, and merge concurrent leaderboards it's, SM, but for this year's TD tracker, we went with the greater good (Sobo). Post-hoc i think we can plug Nobos into the script and generate all their leaderboard data, but we're not promising those splits for anytime soon. In the future it may be simpler for us to run two concurrent trackers on which the opposite-bound riders are simply a selectable 'rider layer', viewable by by last known location, but not in an overcomplicated merged leaderboard. I think this matter starts to delve into the philosphical question of how much to we want to directly compare (in a virtual, single GC, Sobo and Nobo grand depart efforts). I am personally uncertain of the best answer at this point.

[bmike-vt]

i'd think 2 leaderboards would suffice, one above the other. same with all the other data.
personally, i don't see how its useful to 'race' against folks headed in the other direction, aside from the theoretical / philosophical 'he made it through first' sort of thing.

spots should (could) still be seen on the same map, but to compare apples to oranges you'll likely need to see them side by side, instead of on top of one another.

how did it work with justin s. and the non-reroute route? are his times / projections based on the re-route map, or the route he actually took?

[Mathewsen]

Is there some "official" way that riders are notified of potential reroutes because of the fires in NM?  I'm sitting here at home knowing that my hubby (JE) is heading toward that section and he's in an area with no cell coverage to get info.

Elizabeth, first and foremost, all riders are on their own individual expeditions out there, and must make decisions for themselves when things happen too fast on the ground for a volunteer team of TD organizers to address. Fire closures is certainly one scenario. In the absence of direction, the best riders can do is try to document their decisions thru MTBCast and hope that others follow. The Divide racing rule of thumb is to 'try' (to the best of info) to choose the (legal) detour that results in riding the maximum amount of GDMBR (within reason). quadrupling one's mileage just to accomplish this rule of thumb is bordering on unreasonable.

MTB Cast has always been one way to notify riders further back in the pack, but it's not perfect, and often can't catch those at the edge of change. There's no easy answer. We are working on the possible changes in NM and will post something here later today. This year would have been a good year for each racer to establish an alternative liaison from which they could receive info from TD 'mass communiques'. But...managing course dynamics mid-race by mass communiques is a slippery slope. How much should TD organization really engage in this management mid-race? There's liability to think of. There's the insane workload it becomes. It was never really intended to be part of the 'free race' design. This year's event was an unprecedented beast for such issues. Should we have cancelled the event in the name of avoiding it all? Probably not, but it's been a hellacious perfect storm. Double the riders and triple the route trouble. It's a bed we've made, and are doing our best to lie in. With all due respect, this is not a rant. Just a reality check.

[krefs]

So krefs you prob wanted oranges and regular old water nearing the end. What was your drink of choice thru the furnace, or should I say wood stove, to get you to the panhandle?

I was sucking down orange gatorade from my bladder by the gallon! I filled up on it in Cuba, Grants, and Silver City. In the Gila, I had to go with plain water, and I was drinking notably less when it didn't have that sweet/slightly salty flavor.

[Mathewsen]

i'd think 2 leaderboards would suffice, one above the other. same with all the other data.

Yep. just remember, 2 LBs means two complete, fully functioning and configured trackers. Not impossible, just resources are what they are in a two-person operation. The concurrent Grand Departs thing is new. We'll be ready for 2012.

personally, i don't see how its useful to 'race' against folks headed in the other direction, aside from the theoretical / philosophical 'he made it through first' sort of thing.

Yep. mostly theoretical...but has a fun-element, i guess.

Justin is in his own world...but is being judged by the same Sobo route file as the others, so at times he's way 'off route'.

[DaveG]

Matt,

I'm pretty sure I speak for a lot of us when I say that in this technology oriented world, it seems like managing blue dots would be a breeze compared to actually riding the divide. That said, we're all hugely appreciative of tourdivide.org, mtbcast, this forum, and all of the other ways you and many others have worked hard to keep us on the sidelines, and the riders, in the loop. If there is ever a way to chip in and help, I'd be happy to.

[bmike-vt]

Yep. just remember, 2 LBs means two complete, fully functioning and configured trackers. Not impossible, just resources are what they are in a two-person operation.

understand. i wouldn't know where to start...  so to you and scott.

[bikpdlr]

Hopefully all the riders have the capacity for both this and 5-7 liters of water!

Kurt,
I'm having Jeff at Carousel make my bags and I'm trying to decide on a full frame bag vs. a partial bag.  I'm pedalling a Cannondale Flash like Matt Lee and trying to figure out how to avoid a hydration pack on my back.  Are you able to carry 5-7 liters on your bike alone?  I appreciate any suggestions and info you can pass along.

Awesome finish btw ... following you guys on the leaderboard has been jaw-dropping to say the least.  Congrats !!!

Chris Tompkins
Danville, VA

[BobM]

Kurt,
I'm having Jeff at Carousel make my bags and I'm trying to decide on a full frame bag vs. a partial bag.  I'm pedalling a Cannondale Flash like Matt Lee and trying to figure out how to avoid a hydration pack on my back.  Are you able to carry 5-7 liters on your bike alone?  I appreciate any suggestions and info you can pass along.

Awesome finish btw ... following you guys on the leaderboard has been jaw-dropping to say the least.  Congrats !!!

Chris Tompkins
Danville, VA

Full frame divided into upper and lower sections, the upper section made to fit a bladder, works well.

[bcaverly]

Live tracking-generated leaderboards are complex stuff, particularly when you start having two concurrent fields of racers traveling in opposite directions. Scott M may chime in with a better answer than I can provide, but suffice it to say leaderboard data are generated based on geo-fencing and a 'smart route' file that contains a unique numerical value for each mile of the route.

For example, the course mile located 5 miles out from AW can be assigned 'mile 2,740', but i'm pretty sure it cannot simultaneously be 'mile 5' (for the purposes of a leaderboard). If anyone can figure out how to assign two simultaneous values to each unique mile on course, and merge concurrent leaderboards it's, SM, but for this year's TD tracker, we went with the greater good (Sobo). Post-hoc i think we can plug Nobos into the script and generate all their leaderboard data, but we're not promising those splits for anytime soon. In the future it may be simpler for us to run two concurrent trackers on which the opposite-bound riders are simply a selectable 'rider layer', viewable by by last known location, but not in an overcomplicated merged leaderboard. I think this matter starts to delve into the philosphical question of how much to we want to directly compare (in a virtual, single GC, Sobo and Nobo grand depart efforts). I am personally uncertain of the best answer at this point.

Matt,

Thanks for the response - I'd be quite happy with 2 leaderboards FWIW (of course if my buddy Denis does it again next year he's liable to go the other way and I won't care! Murphy's Law!)

For now my concern is simply that something has changed since the mileage numbers that used to display for NoBo riders are now gone and all the NoBo riders have disappeared from the elevation plot as well.  Makes it nearly impossible to tell if Denis is still reeling in Craig or not after his broken spokes going over Fleecer.

Thanks,
Bob

[ScottM]

For now my concern is simply that something has changed since the mileage numbers that used to display for NoBo riders are now gone and all the NoBo riders have disappeared from the elevation plot as well.  Makes it nearly impossible to tell if Denis is still reeling in Craig or not after his broken spokes going over Fleecer.

I've been cleaning up a few things in the code and playing with some new stuff, so that was unintentional.  I'll get route mileage and the dots back on the plot later today.  Sorry 'bout that.

I'm pretty sure I speak for a lot of us when I say that in this technology oriented world, it seems like managing blue dots would be a breeze compared to actually riding the divide.

Endurance programming is in a lot of ways much harder than riding the divide (it is also easier in many ways)... I wished several times I was just out riding my bike.  The week leading up to TD was an endurance event for both Matthew and myself.  Joe is doing a lot of work on the call-ins as well -- if you can, please support his efforts with a paypal donation.

Sorry about the NoBo and ITT riders not showing as full racers.

[BobM]

...Joe is doing a lot of work on the call-ins as well -- if you can, please support his efforts with a paypal donation.

Joe took down his PayPal link the first of the year.  Is there another way to shoot him a donation?

[mikepro]

Both DeeJay Birtch and Ben Onel are in Pie Town...

Quite different departure times this morning for these 2 guys.  Ben Oney out of P. Town early and gets something like a 4-hr jump on Deejay B.

I also like how Caroline S has displayed a gamer attitude by firing out of Cuba around something like 4am local time today, and is already well around the corner from Pueblo Pintado.  Nice riding.

[TXMTBCHICK]

@AZtrailertrash, they are not all young-uns out there!