CTR #3 Route Poll

[e.cutlip]

I attempted it on my own last summer on the fixie and had to bail.  It's no joke hard, but this year I will be on a coastie.  I'll be at the start line no matter what and I do enjoy long walks beside my bike up the side of mountains.  Go with your judgement as you have spent quite a lot of time on the trail!  Singletrack is always the option I prefer.

[Pivvay]

I'm voting to make it harder. I waited until I finished it to do so and still think keeping to the minimum required detours is a good idea. It will be harder, there will be more walking but the remote spots were by far the prettiest.

[Stanley]

I haven't ridden it during the race, but I have hiked it and ridden almost all of it in my first post-race attempt last year. So although I can't speak from the same angle as a past racer... I opt for keeping it consistent with the previous years and not changing anything. Plans are for me to make this year my first race year.

Stanley

[Marshal]

My vote is to leave it as is.  I am a wimp and also do not want to re-think my resupply strat.

[Stanley]

Wait! I like Trail 717's response better, I'm a proud wimp too and I also don't want to have to rethink my food supply situation! Thanks for the "help."

Stanley
Portland, OR
Ketchum, ID
Durango, CO

[timroz]

I decided I can vote since I'll be riding it this summer.  I voted to eliminate the detours.  I'll be there either way.

EDIT:

Man - I stared at Section 22 in the guide book last night for about an hour.  Can I change my vote to leave it as is?   

[joatley]

As is, the route is pretty difficult.  But if you can push a bike 50 miles you can probably push 70 or 80 too.  Maybe being further from Lake City will be a bit tougher, but I didn't stop in LC last year anyway.

Except for the first detour I sort of enjoyed the change of pace that came from the road sections.  And I loved the Cinnamon Pass section. 

If the goal is to make it more difficult then add the trail sections.  Otherwise it seems like a pretty good route as is.  I've been going back-and-forth on this...don't really have a strong opinion.  I'm going to hold onto my vote...lame.



 

[wookieone]

Hello there all, so yeah, I am not sure how I feel about all this, change?! But I suppose I am not so sure what the new route would be, I almost feel I should leave it up to everyone else, go with the flow, I just don't know? I suppose it is the Colorado Trail Race, and it should be as hard as it can be, but that is F-ing hard everyone. That space of the trail south of Lake City is rugged, removed and high altitude, no help or easy bailing out of there. I do also like the idea of comparing records and all that, but that is a minor deal. Lets mae it so hard that next year half instead of double the folks show up. Jefe

[timroz]

Stefan - like you haven't looked at this already.  Anyway here's how previous finishers have voted:

Plesko - remove detours
Dan - remove detours
Stefan - remove detours
Jefe - I can't tell, but I think remove detours
Jeff - too exited to start ultrasport to put any serious thought into this one yet.
Owen - remove detours
Matt - remove detours

I think these are the people MOST LIKELY to do it again so thier vote should really be the only ones that count.  Or at least weigh more than my vote.

Of course they could be trying to make it so hard that no one ever finishes again.  But I doubt it.

[Stefan_G]

Thanks for all your votes and comments everyone.  I really do appreciate the feedback and opinions of all here.

It is indeed interesting that many of the finishers are voting to remove the detours.  Part of me wonders if the pain has really faded that much, or if after conquering one challenge it is in our nature to make the next challenge even harder.  Probably both...

I'm sure that removing the detours will make finishing even more unlikely, but more than anything it just adds a big element of weather-based chance to the race.  If I *knew* with 100% certainty that the weather this year would be the same as last year, there would be no question about sticking to the trail!

Looking to make the final call at the start of March.  Should be more than plenty of time for everyone to plan.

[Mike Brown]

I rode most of Coney/ Cataract last year on my "sllow" 16 day tour of the trail (had to baiil due to storms down the "old" route to the Weimuneche Detour- which meant thigh high creek crossings -fun stuff!).  It was, by far, the most high alpine exposure of the trail.  I personally think it's likely it would add at least one day and maybe two to finishing times- it's that challenging. 

This means y'all racers would have to carry at least 3 and maybe 4 days worth of food, or take the huge detour down to LC- this was one hell of climb back to the trail.  Are you willing to do one or the other?

[Mathewsen]

to clarify, i voted to remove the first detour but not the second unless stefan will be requiring a pro-level bikepacking license to race. as i mentioned in my vote -and mike brown reiterates- it will prob. take mortals 3-4 days of food to make the pull to silverton without a LC binge. my `07 CTR experience was just post-divide racing and i was underweight and very, very hungry so my recollection is more emotionally rooted but it still seems a tough call to me. as we refine our approach to racing the CT, i'm sure it will seem less intimidating, but my advice to CTR rookies would be to "assume" you'll need to hit LC no matter which way the route goes. one interesting effect of removing that detour is it has the potential to blow a close (at that point) race wide open depending on who's prepared/lucky enough not to be forced down to LC.

[ramstrong1]

As a newbie, I think I am going to look forward to the road sections and can imagine this thing is gonna be super tough anyway you look at it!   

[ETURK]

I was thinking last night why not make TWO courses for this race? After all we got all these different categories of races these days. One with the discussed extra credit version - which would certainly command the greater respect - the other as was in the past.

[Stefan_G]

I was thinking last night why not make TWO courses for this race? After all we got all these different categories of races these days. One with the discussed extra credit version - which would certainly command the greater respect - the other as was in the past.

Well, I'd much rather keep it simple and only keep track of 1 race, but if someone chooses to ITT the old course (assuming it changes that is), I'd be happy to keep track of records on the old course.

[dogboydan]

Moon CTR 2009
OK I have not done the race yet. I think my vote should not count. I voted not to change because I fear change without reason.
However I am glad to see that the start date of 2009 Aug 2 is just 4 days before the full moon on Aug 6 2009. That will help everything at night including night riding.
Note in 2008 start date was July 28 and the new moon (dark nights) was 4 days later Aug 1 2008.
I like to see the start date selected to take advantage of the warmest weather and the brightest moon.

I think a good start date for 2010 is Sunday July 25 - full moon is July 26
2011 full moon is Aug 13 the next day is Sunday is Aug 14

[joatley]

Okay, fresh off of 110 or 120 miles of pushing a bike I decided to cast a vote for leaving the route the same.  The sole reason is that I'm assuming that removing the detours will result in more pushing.  There is plenty of hike-a-bike already.  I want to ride.  I'm not in favor of any changes that add more walking.  If, with a couple of days of riding in the legs, the re-routes are rideable then by all means...

[Mike Brown]

I cannot speak for TenMile- I took that detour due to both snow and convenience of food in Frisco.   
Coney-Cataract is, by %, as much hike-a-bike, if not more, than any other two segements of the trail.
YMMV.

[Pivvay]

Why change? 2 reasons.

1) I expected a hard route and got one but when I drive by Copper Mtn and know every time that I took the bike path I think "darn I didn't do all the trail". If I have to skip it legally then that's okay but why skip stuff that's available? The weather may suck but oh well, that's why you pack rain gear and learn to hide. Plus the website has always said "finish it before you question making it harder", well now I've finished it so that's my $0.02.

2) I had a really really nice time on the trail when I left Mt.P hot springs. That night I made dinner all by myself on my little stove, got a little rain, took some amazing sunset pictures and did a lot of hiking. I was so stoked when I finally decided I should lay down for some sleep that I could barely fall asleep.

I suspect the latter section would be pretty awesome in the "out there" vibe, so what if you have to bring a little more food? I still had food left that I packed from the start when I rolled into Durango and had another hot meal too. I could have totally skipped Silverton from a food perspective last year and gone Mt.P HS to the end. I'm not saying easy pizza in Silverton was a bad thing but carrying the calories and fuel to cook dinner isn't that hard.

As for the records well the absolute best style (that we can condone) would be riding the entire legal route so IMO that record would trump previous ones anyway. Besides don't we care more about getting to ride the route than holding the record? If the route is too hard then fast tour it until you feel you're ready.

I have one more question...where does Marshall stand on the route changes?

[dream4est]

I voted to add the extra segments. I will be there for the race start and probably will ride those segments even if Stefan decides to not add them. My feeling is that since the CTR is the best route of the unsupported races/rides why not add all the legal ST? Since the Grand Loop is not a race anymore it would make sense to improve other routes. People are finishing the current route in impressive fashion.

If I were Stefan, I would add the 3 segments and change the first detour to Hwy. 285. I would rather hike in the woods/tundra than ride an extra 50 miles in Tarryall. I did the 285 way last year on my ITT and it is not that dangerous. That would make a nice "trade" of mileage from detour to ST.

Whatever happens it is still the king of all ITT's IMO. I am stoked to be heading to Durango for the third straight summer. I may even head out for a pre-CTR ITT the first/second week of July. Maybe start from Durango. Anyone else interested in a practice lap?

Mark C.