Poll
Question: Ride the longer-but-peacefull Tarryall detour, or the shorter-but-scary US-285?
US-285 - 13 (29.5%)
Tarryall - 31 (70.5%)
Total Voters: 44

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  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) on: April 10, 2013, 08:41:38 PM
Stefan_G


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« on: April 10, 2013, 08:41:38 PM »

Since we are switching directions this year already, I thought why not throw another potential change in the mix!? About 90% of CTR veterans I talk to say they hate the US-285 detour, as do I.  It's scary, dangerous, and quite out of character with the rest of the event.

A bit of history: originally, we were trying to keep the lengths the same between the 07/08 course and the 09 and later courses.  In 07/08, we rode Tarryall + 10 mile bikepath + Cinnamon Pass. The current course uses Hwy 285 + CT Seg. 7 + CT Seg. 22/23.  The long, but 100% rideable Tarryall detour was replaced with US-285 and loads of hike-a-bike in beautiful places and the winning times seemed to be comparable.

I'm attaching a couple of .gpx files so folks can examine and see the difference between the two. The Tarryall one is hand drawn, so elevations may be inaccurate, though I believe the elevation changes to be similar.  The Tarryall detour is 75 miles long, the US-285 detour is 27 miles long. Both have amount the same amount of pavement, but the traffic on US-285 is 100x worse.

So, here are some factors in favor/against changing the course.  PLEASE weigh in with not just a vote, but a comment on why and also whether or not you intend to ride the CTR in 2013. And feel free to chime in with more factors for me to add below.

Factors IN FAVOR of Tarryall Detour
  • Safer and more pleasant than US-285
  • 5 more miles of sweet CT singletrack east of Kenosha!

Factors AGAINST the Tarryall Detour
  • Times and Course Records no longer comparable.
  • No resupply in Bailey.

* Tarryall Detour.gpx (23.07 KB - downloaded 89 times.)
* US285 Detour.gpx (30.97 KB - downloaded 58 times.)
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“The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.”
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  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #1 on: April 10, 2013, 08:59:07 PM
Eszter


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« Reply #1 on: April 10, 2013, 08:59:07 PM »

I'd have to vote to keep the 285 in. 

I think it would be absolutely sinful to leave out 22/33, and the 10-Mile builds character.  But no, I'm not planning on racing in 2013. 

Northbound especially, you'll be on 285 for an hour or less going down Kenosha. 
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  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #2 on: April 10, 2013, 09:04:11 PM
THE LONG RANGER

Hi-Ho, Single-Speed, AWAY!


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« Reply #2 on: April 10, 2013, 09:04:11 PM »

Here's a link to the detours on a map:

* 285
http://www.gpsvisualizer.com/display/1365652706-20640-65.128.101.60.html

* Tarryall
http://www.gpsvisualizer.com/display/1365652764-20652-65.128.101.60.html

I'm fairly certain I've been on Tarryall (or something similar) - looks like it skirts around Lost Creek Wilderness?

I'm only in for a, "maybe, if things align" status for the CTR this year - and only then for an ITT (probably), but it does seem that if you're going NB, that the time you hit 285 is going to be all over the place, and 285 is bad enough during the day time, it's certainly not something I'd suggest at night.

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  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #3 on: April 10, 2013, 09:04:35 PM
Stefan_G


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« Reply #3 on: April 10, 2013, 09:04:35 PM »

I'd have to vote to keep the 285 in.
I think you may have cast your vote the wrong way then!  Thanks, Eszter.
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“The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.”
  -- frequently (mis)attributed to Thomas Jefferson

  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #4 on: April 10, 2013, 09:07:28 PM
THE LONG RANGER

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« Reply #4 on: April 10, 2013, 09:07:28 PM »

One more thing to weigh in w/285 is the construction going on, just East of Idaho Springs, on one of the I-70 tunnels. I think more people are getting the idea that 285 is an interesting alternative to I-70 to get in the mountains from Denver, for the weekend.
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  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #5 on: April 10, 2013, 10:05:45 PM
Marshal


Location: Colorado
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« Reply #5 on: April 10, 2013, 10:05:45 PM »

Having done both NB it's really not a big issue for me--

but I vote keep 285 --

main reason is minimal resupply on Tarryall

and a secondary reason is remembering the long hot boring gravel roads through burnt out forest
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  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #6 on: April 11, 2013, 07:24:26 AM
jakomait


Location: Colorado Springs, CO
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« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2013, 07:24:26 AM »

Just to be clear Stefan, the choice on the Lost Creek Wilderness bypass has no effect on seg 22 & 23 right?  Either way we keep Seg 22 & 23, this is only deciding to add more course on the dirt road or continue on 285 and pass through Bailey.

I think Eszter might have been thinking you would have to trade one for another.
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  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #7 on: April 11, 2013, 07:51:16 AM
tetontodd


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« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2013, 07:51:16 AM »

I vote to keep 285. Going downhill from Kenosha won't be that bad, maybe 45 minutes to get to the dirt road that brings you into bailey, as compared to 2 hrs of being exposed climbing up 285.
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  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #8 on: April 11, 2013, 08:52:18 AM
JosiahM


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« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2013, 08:52:18 AM »

is it downhill miles?
are you suggesting that we take out the ten mile and 22/23? or that we still leave all that the same and just change that one detour?
as painful as it is to say, I think 22/23 are kinda what make the CTR the challenge that it is.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2013, 08:57:05 AM by JosiahM » Logged

  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #9 on: April 11, 2013, 09:01:05 AM
tetontodd


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« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2013, 09:01:05 AM »

285 detour won't impact 22/23. The only thing it would impact is Going up and over Ten mile.
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  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #10 on: April 11, 2013, 09:28:24 AM
Done


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« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2013, 09:28:24 AM »

Sounds like neither Tarryall or 285 are great rides. I'm looking forward to the day when the Bailey Trails Project adds the proposed singletrack connector. That's probably years (decades?) away through, so until then I vote for whatever route is harder, more remote, and has more singletrack or dirt. That looks like Tarryall, for better or worse. I'd rather sweat from a little heat then from having some moron in a Winnebago breathing down my neck!

I'm 75% sure that I'll be riding the CTR this year.
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  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #11 on: April 11, 2013, 09:29:16 AM
tetontodd


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« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2013, 09:29:16 AM »

Duh, it wouldn't impact ten mile. I spoke too fast.
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  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #12 on: April 11, 2013, 10:06:36 AM
Stefan_G


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« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2013, 10:06:36 AM »

Just to be clear Stefan, the choice on the Lost Creek Wilderness bypass has no effect on seg 22 & 23 right?  Either way we keep Seg 22 & 23, this is only deciding to add more course on the dirt road or continue on 285 and pass through Bailey.

Yes!  Everything else stays the same.  Only difference would be Tarryall in exchange for US-285.

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“The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.”
  -- frequently (mis)attributed to Thomas Jefferson

  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #13 on: April 11, 2013, 10:14:29 AM
pharmvet


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« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2013, 10:14:29 AM »

I'm most likely in for SB ITT this year and will be doing the Tarryall detour with resupply (if needed), off Kenosha into Jefferson.  Tarryall just seems to be more in the ethos of the whole ride and, if doing it makes the resupply more challenging, so be it.  Heck, the resupply from BV to Silverton is pretty challenging and we accept that as a matter of course.

As far as NB goes, boy I'm not sure riding 285 in low-light conditions would be a good deal, even if it's only for 45 minutes, especially if sleep-deprived.  BTW, many of the resupply options in Bailey or Jefferson are not all night operations so keep that in mind for planning purposes.

I kind of consider the CT from Waterton to Breck as "frontcountry" and the rest more "backcountry".  Amping up the challenge of the "frontcountry" section would always seem like a good choice, IMHO.
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  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #14 on: April 11, 2013, 10:25:23 AM
asatrur


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« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2013, 10:25:23 AM »

Newbie here, but I would vote for Tarryall, as it is harder, more remote and safer from idiots. I am not riding the CTR this year, as I am still working up to that level.
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  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #15 on: April 11, 2013, 10:27:42 AM
JosiahM


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« Reply #15 on: April 11, 2013, 10:27:42 AM »

I like the idea of more singletrack and dirt.
only thing really worth note in favor of 285 is time requirements.
I'd guess one of the biggest reasons people quit is because they either choose not to or can't take more than a week of vacation... this isn't an issue for the immortals (the ones who posses bikepacking abilities above human capabilities) but for a lot of people, getting to colorado, riding the whole thing and getting back to wherever you came from within a week's time can be quite difficult.
other than that, Tarryall seems like a nice little change up.
also, I will be doing ctr this year. ITT starting saturday afternoon from durango to try to help get to silverton before they close next day
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  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #16 on: April 11, 2013, 10:53:33 AM
markphx


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« Reply #16 on: April 11, 2013, 10:53:33 AM »

I vote for whatever route is harder, more remote, and has more singletrack or dirt. That looks like Tarryall, for better or worse.

Agreed. I'll be riding the CTR again this year. Can't wait!
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  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #17 on: April 11, 2013, 11:24:59 AM
Eszter


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« Reply #17 on: April 11, 2013, 11:24:59 AM »

If the rest of the route stays the same, I'd vote Tarryall.  More dirt=more better.
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  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #18 on: April 11, 2013, 11:26:48 AM
Stefan_G


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« Reply #18 on: April 11, 2013, 11:26:48 AM »

If the rest of the route stays the same, I'd vote Tarryall.  More dirt=more better.

Absolutely!  No way Segments 22/23 are gonna get removed!
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“The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.”
  -- frequently (mis)attributed to Thomas Jefferson

  Topic Name: CTR 2013 Route Change Poll (US-285 vs. Tarryall) Reply #19 on: April 11, 2013, 11:35:04 AM
Eszter


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« Reply #19 on: April 11, 2013, 11:35:04 AM »

Would 10-mile stay? That descent is wicked fun in the dark!  And wicked scary.  No point in taking a part out of a route just because it's hard...

With 10-mile and 22/23, I'd definitely vote Tarryall. 

If all goes according to plan, I'll be there in 2014.
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