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  Topic Name: Road shifter on a drop bar 29'r? on: June 10, 2011, 10:06:22 PM
mmeiser

Less Stuff. More Freedom!


Location: SE Micigan
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« on: June 10, 2011, 10:06:22 PM »

I've posted the below on my blog as well: http://blog.mmeiser.com/2011/06/road-shifters-on-salsa-fargo.html

Going STI shifter, wondering what others think

I've been diligently looking for an alternative to bar end shifters for about two years now and it just so happens I've scored a sweet mismatched set of used Durace / Ultegra STI shifters which should be absolutely perfect for the job. Obviously I'll have to use a cable doubler, but it should be lighter, quicker shifting, no need to take my hands off the bar in singletrack and so many more advantages.

Indeed the only disadvantage I can think of is it will impede bivy roll space a little, but with my bikepacking gear now so well dialed and my frame bags so big (XXL frame) I only ever use a bivy roll in winter. 


http://www.flickr.com/photos/mmeiser2/5361146593/#

Ironically my road bike, a salsa campeon with a compact double has pretty much the exact same setup already! Smiley

Specifically I was doing a road ride on my Campeon here in Ohio called the CFC (Columbus Fall challenge, 17,000 vertical feet, 200+ miles, 2 days,one of my favorite organized rides) and I needed the extra gear so I put an XT long cage derailleur and a 34-12 on my road bike opposite my compact 50-34 cranks. It worked flawlessly and brilliantly. In fact it worked so brilliantly that I've kept it that way. Indeed I've dialed in the low cogs for road riding cadence and can hang with even the fastest group rides with the local area clubs (avg 21/22+mph). So, I actually know the setup will shift flawlessly. I've already put at least 3k miles on it.

Inversely I have on multiple occasions run rapidfire with ultegra and durace derailleurs with no issues. I should state this is 100% 9-speed. Can't speak for the 10 speed stuff at all.

So... about the only thing I don't know is how well the braking will work with a cable doubler and what cable doublers one might recommend??

Mud? Some people have brought up the mud issue, citing the inability to micro-adjust shifting or turn off the indexing like you can with a bar end shifter. But technically most people run Rapidfire shifters on trips like the great divide which has no friction mode and not even half clicks like the STI triple shifter. I have run rapidfire, STI and bar end shifters for years (albeit STI never off road) and can't think the STI shifting will be anything but a huge plus even in the mud.

Durability? The thought has come to mind that the STI while more protected then the bar end shifters could be susceptible to taking a major hit (i.e. on a tree) and/or be more susceptible to mud/rain/wear long term wear.  I guess only time and experience will tell.

Why not bar end?

Doing technical midwestern singletrack I've come to the conclusion that I hate bar end shifters on my fargo. Love the fargo, love bar end shifters, just not the combination. Indeed on my onroad / backroad Cross Check touring bike bar end shifters are awesome. However the fargo is a singletrack beast capable of even the most technical singletrack and all but downhill, even with drop bars. But my fargo mine as well be singlespeed for the shifting capability of bar end shifters in technical trail riding. One cannot simply remove their hand from the bar in technical riding, reach down and slap the shifter into the exact right gear before returning the hand to the bar. Especially when the left shifter is not indexed. God forbid one should need to shift both left and right shifters at once.

Furthermore with a woodchipper bar with it's flaired drops the bar end shifters are extremely exposed. Indeed on my first major trip with it last year (TransWisconsin) I dropped my fargo on its side and busted the right bar end shifter. When laid on its side or dropped the bike simply does lay/land on the bar end shifter. Even if turning the shifters inward toward the bottom they're still very likely to take a hit if the bike is dropped or falls over. THis is not even to mention the knee issues with bar end shifters and technical singletrack.

So! What do others think? Anyone have any experience?
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  Topic Name: Road shifter on a drop bar 29'r? Reply #1 on: June 11, 2011, 09:29:00 AM
bmike-vt


Location: Horgen, Switzerland
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« Reply #1 on: June 11, 2011, 09:29:00 AM »

been enjoying everything but the front shifting with the stock 011 fargo build using sram apex levers. the fd needs some maintenance love, and wish salsa would have done the frame with proper dt mounts to use adjusters there. i've got inlines on the brakes and the shifters.

on my road machine i've played with running campy 10spd ergolever with 8spd cassettes and a shimano mech. works well, and a friend runs campy 10spd lever with shimano 9spd mech and cassette for cross as 1x9 and loves it. this is where i'm likely headed with my dirt road / rando rig, when the last of my campy cassettes dies. 2x8 or 2x9.

that all said, i'd consider going to sram - either 9 or 10spd (if you can still get the 9spd) on the if and the fargo. happy so far. borrowed an older fargo from a friend with bar ends, and while i like bar ends and would use them for an adventure rig - i hated them on the single track... and any time i had to push the bike. and they are exposed out there for sure...
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  Topic Name: Road shifter on a drop bar 29'r? Reply #2 on: June 11, 2011, 11:13:46 AM
paxton coyote


Location: Paxton, Nebraska
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« Reply #2 on: June 11, 2011, 11:13:46 AM »

 I finally took my '11 Fargo in last Fri for shifting issues after 500+ miles on it & my bike mechanic got it dialed in quite well, it was the front shifting that was giving me the issues, not sure what he did but it performed last Sun riding sigletrack in the canyons FLAWLESSLY!
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  Topic Name: Road shifter on a drop bar 29'r? Reply #3 on: June 16, 2011, 10:45:26 AM
ArisaemaDracontium


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« Reply #3 on: June 16, 2011, 10:45:26 AM »

If you haven't worked this out and moved on yet...

So you already know that 9-speed Shimano road and mountain stuff is compatible.  Unfortunately this is not the case for 10-speed... if you want 10-speed you need to go to SRAM.  I have a monstercross bike set up with Rival shifters and XX everything else and it works quite well. 

OK the SHIFTING works well.  For brakes I have the Avid BB7-road, which do work with the Rival brifters but I am still not happy with the performance.  This is my first disc-brake bike so maybe its the mechanic, but the brakes rub when I stand up to hammer AND it takes a lot of pull on the levers to actuate the brakes.  I may try something like the metal tubes of the Avid Full Metal Jacket to see if I can stiffen up the system a bit to get better performance... Or maybe I'll just wait and see if someone comes up with hydrolic road brifters... but that would be a pretty expensive upgrade.  You might try the Problem Solvers Travel Agent to make your road levers compatible with standard BB7 brakes.
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  Topic Name: Road shifter on a drop bar 29'r? Reply #4 on: June 27, 2011, 03:14:54 PM
mgersib


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« Reply #4 on: June 27, 2011, 03:14:54 PM »

@ArisaemaDracontium, I'm not sure why you say 10-speed Shimano shifters won't work (assuming the rest of the setup is 10sp). You can easily swap in a Shimano mountain derailleur to a setup with Shimano 10sp shifters and cassette, and the bike will shift just fine. The cable pull ratio on both rear derailleur types is the same, so both will work with the shifters.  There is a small difference in cable pull between the road and mountain front derailleurs, but even that is workable, from my experience.

But Mike's questions are related to 9 speed stuff anyway, and in that realm, while he's going to have a little more difficulty finding clean/new shifters, he's going to have an easy time with compatibility.  On my Ti Fargo, I run a mismatched set of Shimano STI shifters - a 105 front and Tiagra rear.  I'd love to score a set of Dura Ace 9sp shifters, but these are what I've got for now, and shift quality is good, so I don't really want for much.
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  Topic Name: Road shifter on a drop bar 29'r? Reply #5 on: June 30, 2011, 07:56:08 PM
ArisaemaDracontium


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« Reply #5 on: June 30, 2011, 07:56:08 PM »

I did a lot of research last fall when I set up my monstercross bike, and all the cool kids were saying that 10-speed Shimano mtb derailleurs and road shifters do not play well together.
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  Topic Name: Road shifter on a drop bar 29'r? Reply #6 on: July 02, 2011, 07:17:14 AM
ArisaemaDracontium


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« Reply #6 on: July 02, 2011, 07:17:14 AM »

You know, it could have been that Shimano MTB 10-speed wasn't out yet and the 9-speed road and mountain were not cross compatible... but that doesn't make sense either. 
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  Topic Name: Road shifter on a drop bar 29'r? Reply #7 on: July 14, 2011, 12:57:43 AM
mtndragon


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« Reply #7 on: July 14, 2011, 12:57:43 AM »

I am running a 10 speed 11-36 XT cassette with 10 speed Ultegra brifters and a 9 speed Long Cage XT shadow rear derailleur on my Frankenstein Cross/tour/commute bike.  Works like butta.  I found the details here originally:

http://www.bikeradar.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12733834

!0 speed XT derailleurs do not work with 10 speed road STI shifters, but 9 XT derailleurs do work, and you get all 10 speeds.

Hope this helps-
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